Reason Rally: Pleased for P.Z.

Will P.Z. Myers change his policy after Reason Rally? Let’s talk about it on Deeper Waters.

P.Z. Myers isn’t too happy. Who is he? He’s the evolutionary biologist who is the blogger at Pharyngula. Apparently, he’s upset that a number of Christians plan to attend the Reason Rally. The post can be found here. Now he’s made a statement about a personal policy of his that I’d like to comment on.

I’m beginning to feel like my long-standing personal policy of not intruding on their church services needs to be questioned, because man, is this ever arrogant and obnoxious.

First off, a problem with us. One thing that I am sure of is that in a lot of churches, if someone like Meyers showed up, they would not be ready. Where there could be well over 100 Christians, not one of them would be able to give an answer and most of them would say that you just have to have faith.

Ugh. Makes me sick.

If you’re someone new to the faith, maybe I could grant you some leeway, but by and large our churches are failing at this point. We are not educating our members and sometimes I can understand why atheists think they are the champions of reason because there are too many Christians out there who aren’t thinking about their faith. They’re just living in their own world content with just knowing that Jesus loves them.

These churches will be trounced and there will be casualties leading to either new atheists who really don’t think seriously about religion (Several of which you can find on Meyers’s own blog) or else the situation of the Christians in these churches just further retreating into themselves and cutting themselves off from the world.

You will have a hard time getting the gospel to the world the more you retreat inside yourself.

That gets us to another point. Why is it that we have made churches more like isolation chambers. Now I do know we need places to congregate, but these should also be places where unbelievers can expect to have their questions on Christianity answered and where they can think they can go to to get those questions answered instead of having the mindset of “Just let them be.”

In fact, in 1 Cor. 14 Paul talks about how Christians should behave for when unbelievers come in. He is talking about the appearance that we will have before a world that is watching. Why is it that the church is not seen as a beacon of intellectualism? It is because we Christians did abandon intellectual grounds among the laity and much amongst the leadership as well. If we think the new atheist movement is truly lacking in reason, which I think they are, it is because the church lacked it first.

However, as to what Meyers has said, I will say that whatever church I find myself in, and I do not know which that will be since my wife and I will be moving soon, I would be delighted for Meyers to come to my church and to ask the hardest questions that he can think of. In fact, I would actually celebrate that opportunity. I would love to tell all my friends and family that Meyers came to my church today.

It would be ideal if this could happen in any church, but sadly, it wouldn’t. As I said, too many are unprepared and there will be a lot of casualties in the faith in several churches. Whose fault is this? It is not the fault of Christianity. It is not the fault of the new atheists. It is our fault.

Our churches do several great ministries by and large. We are often willing to set up soup kitchens and food pantries for those in need. We will help people with their bills when things get too difficult for them financially. We will help them with alcoholism and working through a divorce and with grief counseling when a loved one dies and we will send missionaries overseas to spread the gospel.

How much is the church investing in apologetics?

If Christianity is not true, then we are doing some nice things, but we are to be pitied for believing a lie.

Yet I am regularly concerned about churches that will spend millions on big buildings and gyms and everything else, but when it comes to supporting the work of the apologists, the ones who are on the front lines defending all the other work that is going on, there is nothing.

That’s why the people at True Reason also need your support. They are out there on the front lines. For my own self, I’m out there as well. This blog is not the only thing I do, but there is a donate button for a reason. It is people like you that keep this going.

Maybe if the church returns to being a force in intellectualism again and regains our apologetic ability, maybe we’ll actually start seeing a turnaround. Many of us complain about the evil we see in our society, but our idea is to sit back and just pray. Prayer is a good thing to do. It is never to be used as an excuse to laziness. I suggest we use Nehemiah 4:9 as an example. When the walls of Jerusalem were being rebuilt and the people were in danger, Nehemiah said they prayed and posted a guard. We, the apologists, are the guard. Support us and pray for us as well. Some of you I am sure cannot support financially, and in that case do pray, but also be an encouragement. Those of us on the front lines need it more than you realize.

Be a support today. When Meyers comes to your church, be ready to prevent casualties.

In Christ,
Nick Peters

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12 Responses to “Reason Rally: Pleased for P.Z.”

  1. Dan Says:

    Isn’t Myers the one who is afraid to let anyone who disagrees with him comment on his blog?

  2. Simplexion Says:

    by and large our churches are failing at this point. We are not educating our members

    I think it is safe to say that avoiding educating your members is a great idea. Education is the bane of all religion. You don’t want to over-educate them because then you wouldn’t have any members. Did you mean brainwash them with authoritative statements?

    These churches will be trounced and there will be casualties leading to either new atheists who really don’t think seriously about religion

    How do you seriously think about religion? Here is a story written by people with much much less knowledge than we have today. They make a claim about how the world came to being with absolutely no evidence at all. Our increase in knowledge is continuously destroying the claimed “truths” in this old book. You should think seriously about it though.

    these should also be places where unbelievers can expect to have their questions on Christianity answered

    Why would unbelievers go to a place where they get a ridiculously biased answer to questions about your religion? We have this wonderful thing called the “Internet” where you can have your questions answered by all sorts of people, including ones not brainwashed by .

    It is because we Christians did abandon intellectual grounds among the laity

    Well… it would be hard for Christians to not abandon intellectual ground considering their whole belief system is nonsense. I make a claim there is an invisible fart goblin that created the universe with an exceptional fart and in 2000 years I hope this to be called a religion and there be no way for anyone to disprove it… because you can’t prove that something does not exist.

    If Christianity is not true, then we are doing some nice things, but we are to be pitied for believing a lie.

    I don’t pity you… would you pity a child for believing in Santa Claus?

    Maybe if the church returns to being a force in intellectualism again and regains our apologetic ability

    It never can return to power. The problem is that the intellectualism of the church has not reduced. The intelligence of humans has increased beyond needing gods to explain things. We know too much now.

    Many of us complain about the evil we see in our society

    There is less evil these days than ever before. http://reason.com/blog/2012/01/11/steven-pinker-on-the-triumph-of-peace-an
    As religion reduces, so does the evils in this world.

    • J. P. Holding Says:

      Wow, I’ve never seen so much irony combined with the Dunning Effect in such a short space. Plus now chronological snobbery and bigotry. This is what atheism can do for you, too! :D

  3. apologianick Says:

    For someone so sure about his position, you’d think he’d show up at TheologyWeb.com. Must not be secure in his education.

    • Simplexion Says:

      I’m sorry your blog with the ability to post comments, or you could say a forum, isn’t appropriate to have these kinds of discussions. Hold on while I sign up to a website moderated by you, disallowing an open discussion, as it requires login.

      • J. P. Holding Says:

        And you wonder why you earn descriptions like that last one. Excuses like that are suitable for a two year old — which is what you are intellectually as well.

  4. apologianick Says:

    TWeb is not moderated by me. If anything, this blog is moderated by me. TWeb would be a place where if you fear my moderation, you’d have a lot less of it, especially since we don’t mod people for disagreeing. We have a number of atheists on the site.

    We’ll be in the Deeper Waters section.

  5. Cerebrum123 Says:

    Simplexion that was one AMAZINGLY condescending post up there ,and YOU wonder why the people here are attacking YOU? I’m not nearly as educated as some of the people on here ,but at least I am willing to learn instead of saying how wrong someone else is without offering a real argument. I have posted on a mostly Christian hostile site ,and have met your kind many times ,but there are at least a FEW people over there who aren’t just dismissing the other side out of hand. That’s the main reason I post over there. I only recently joined TWeb ,so the majority of my posting has been in what you might call “enemy territory” (I don’t say this to be mean to them ,but they are pretty hostile towards those who disagree with them).
    I had felt that this applied to them Matthew 9:12
    On hearing this, Jesus said, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick.
    Right now I am taking a break (it’s exhausting dealing with a certain few over there) ,and am taking time to study not only their arguments ,but the best ones for me to use to counteract them.

    • Simplexion Says:

      You’ve met “my” kind have you? People tired of having to deal with the stupidity of religion in an age of information and knowledge? I was being rather rude in my comment above because it is hard to take this blog seriously. I enjoy discussing the possibility of Jesus actually existing as a man but tire of this kind of nonsense.
      They are welcome to blindly follow their religion, but when they say they are doing it critically and with intelligence I can do nothing but insult. It is against intelligence to not be willing to change your mind and they are not willing to change their mind as there is NO way to prove that something does NOT exist. I am willing to change my mind about their religion if they can present some proof for it because you can prove something DOES exist.

      • J. P. Holding Says:

        >>People tired of having to deal with the stupidity of religion in an age of information and knowledge?

        No, people who have a severe Dunning Effect, have no idea how to sift information and knowledge critically, were as uncritical and ignorant as fundies as they are now as fundy atheists, and use prefabricated canard phrases and stupid arguments about bias when their arguments get trashed.

        We don’t take you seriously either, and you’re too ignorant to ever understand why you deserve everything you get here.

  6. Cerebrum123 Says:

    @ Simplexion
    By “your kind” I meant people who think that anyone who believes in God is an absolute moron just due to that fact alone. The people I have dealt with would dismiss my arguments for that fact alone ,and not have anything to with the content of what was said (most of the time anyway ,there were times I was wrong ,and I always admitted a mistake on my part). I believe that to ignore information just because of who it comes from is called the Genetic Fallacy ,and I encounter it far too often. These people didn’t realize that an insult was not the same as a refutation ,even though I pointed this out multiple times.

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